People watch the presidential debate between Vice President Harris and former President Donald Trump during a debate watch party at Penn Social on Sept. 10 in Washington, D.C.
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Most people have decided who they are going to vote for. Former President Donald Trump is well known and polarizing — people either love him or hate him. Vice President Harris is famous, but voters say they don’t know her as well.
Polls show an incredibly tight race between them, and a handful of swing voters could decide the election, depending on who they vote for or if they decide to stay home.
Only a tiny slice of the electorate is considered persuadable — anywhere from 6% or less to the low teens.
There were nearly four dozen undecided voters in the NPR/PBS News/Marist poll in the last four months who gave permission to call them back to follow up. To understand their current thinking and motivations, NPR tried them all and got in touch with 10 by phone in the days following the Harris-Trump debate. What we found was notable.
First, the debate was important for Harris. Most who watched said she performed better than Trump. They were not all moved to vote for her as a result, but four who seemed to need a degree of reassurance about Harris are now voting for her or leaning Harris’ direction after the debate.
And while undecided voters often have unique reasons for what influences their votes, there was a clear gender divide. All four who say they are now voting for or leaning toward Harris are women. That also reflects the wide gender gap seen in pollsbetween the candidates.
The other six — one woman and five men — were a mix. Five said they likely won’t be voting for Harris, most citing the economy or immigration as reasons. One other said he is still truly undecided, but said prices are a major concern. Two are leaning toward Trump; another said she aligns more with Robert F. Kennedy Jr.; a self-described progressive said he doesn’t like Harris’ stance on the war in Gaza; and one other, a conservative, said he might not vote at all.
Many did not want to use their full names; some didn’t want us to use any name at all. They cited security concerns. They said in this political environment, they were apprehensive about giving out too much personally identifiable information.
Here’s what they had to say:
Brady, 30, Wisconsin, leaning Trump
On the debate, Brady said, “Kamala [Harris] did a better job articulating her points, obviously.”
He added: “I don’t want to go through another four years of a Trump presidency.”
But his vote is largely contingent on his personal financial situation, and he noted, “Things have gotten more expensive.”
“I have probably a middle-class income for my family,” he said, “and it doesn’t feel like it’s getting any easier — even as my wife and I have advanced in our careers.”
Brady said he aligned more with former President Barack Obama, and said he doesn’t “like her policies” on the economy.
Asked what specifically he doesn’t like, he said, “I can’t say I’m super knowledgeable about the specifics, but from a how-our-family-is-feeling standpoint, just not sure.”
Lee, 59, Wisconsin, leaning Trump
Lee did not like how ABC handled the debate, specifically the fact-checking. He felt the moderators “teamed up on Trump.”
He felt Harris did almost too well, saying it was “almost like rehearsed.” But he said he “never got any message from Harris” and said she “skirted issues,” including the Biden administration’s “inability to stop the flow of migrants” and the economy.
“Trump stuck his foot in his mouth multiple times,” Lee said, though.
He said he wanted to see Trump, whom he trusts more on the economy, debate again and was unaware that Trump had said he would not do another debate with Harris. When told that, Lee said he was “disappointed.”
He said he’s “not a big Republican, not a big Democrat.” He voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, the progressive independent from Vermont, in the 2016 primary and is now leaning toward Trump, independent Cornel West or the Green Party’s Jill Stein (not from an environmental standpoint, however, because he thinks the Green New Deal “went too far”).
“But I don’t want to piss away my vote,” he said, pointing out that he is leaning most toward Trump because of that.
Woman, declined to give name, 68, Oregon, undecided
Of the debate, the respondent said, “I was like, OK, who are these people? They were like bad actors. Kamala, suddenly she was so articulate when it’s usually word salad. There was something weird going on there.”
Absentee ballots are prepared to be mailed at the Wake County Board of Elections on Tuesday in Raleigh, N.C.
Allison Joyce/Getty Images
Trump, on the other hand, she said, it was like “something was in his water,” and he wasn’t his usual self.
She said this of her ideal ticket: “If RFK [Jr.] was on the ticket with [former Rep.] Tulsi Gabbard [of Hawaii], it would have been a slam dunk for me.”
Of Trump and Harris, she said: “I am reluctant to vote for Trump, but I have absolutely no confidence about Kamala Harris’ ability to do anything about the border at all. We’re suffering for it.”
She said she didn’t vote in the 2020 election, and that she doesn’t trust Trump fully, because he signed the CARES act, a COVID relief bill.
“He is aesthetically lacking,” she said, laughing, but “the major Trump haters are missing the whole point. They’re not looking at issues; they’re looking at personality.”
Jene Proffitt, 45, Arkansas, leaning Harris
Proffitt did not see the debate or follow news about it afterward. She said she voted for Trump in 2016 and did not vote for president in 2020. But she is resolved to do so this time.
“I’m going to go out and will vote this year,” said Proffitt, a mother of five. “It’s a right I should exercise. I want to show my kids that’s a right.”
Of the candidates, she said she doesn’t know much at this point about Harris’ policy positions, but she is leaning her direction because of Trump.
“I feel Trump’s disrespect for women is not befitting of a president,” she said. “He is not someone I want my girls to look up to as a role model.”
About Harris, she added: “She’s a woman, and maybe having a female president would do the country some good. … I gave the other guy a try, why not give her a try?”
Phyllis Bohlman, 76, Idaho, voting Harris
A Republican and former interior decorator and rancher, Bohlman said she made the switch to vote Democratic when Trump came on the scene.
“No, I have not voted for Trump, nor will I ever,” Bohlman said. “I have never been able to stand the guy since he came into the picture years ago. I even took a book away from my 16-year-old son that [Trump] had written about making money. He didn’t make his money; he inherited it and lost it. He’s not a good businessman. He’s not anything but a narcissistic misogynist.”
She was undecided in May, but is now locked in for Harris. She said she saw the debate and thought Harris performed well.
“I will vote Democrat,” Bohlman said. “I will vote for Kamala. I liked the way she came across in the debate. She is a very astute, intelligent woman, who knows exactly where she’s going. She doesn’t hinge her judgment on whether she likes someone or not.”
She went on to cite the overturning of Roe v. Wade abortion protections, which she blames squarely on Trump, as another motivating factor for her to vote for Harris.
“I am so angry about that,” she said of the Supreme Court’s Dobbs decision. “It’s so unfair that a bunch of men are making decisions for women. I think it’s horrific.”
Bohlman also brought up the siege at the Capitol on Jan. 6, which she said was “appalling,” called out GOP leaders’ hypocrisy in criticizing Trump initially and then trying to get back in his good graces, and she noted that she has lots of family members who are “adamantly pro-Trump.”
“They do not look at the whole picture,” she said of Trump supporters. “I’m sure after this second [assassination] attempt, they’ll be saying, ‘God is protecting him.’ It’s just a bunch of crock.”
Annette, declined to give age, Illinois, voting Harris
Annette is a registered independent who generally votes Democratic. In June, she was undecided if she would vote at all because she was concerned about President Biden’s age and ability to do the job.
“I didn’t realize how bad he was,” Annette said after watching Biden in the June 27 debate. “He lost his oomph. He made Trump look good.”
But now, she is enthusiastically backing Harris.
“I would never vote for him,” Annette said of Trump. She called herself “happily surprised, maybe not surprised, but happy with [Harris’] presentation” at the debate. Annette said Harris proved she’s “perfectly capable.”
Dr. Linda Remensnyder, 76, Illinois, voting Harris
Remensnyder is a registered independent, but described herself as a “Republican at heart.”
“I really liked Nikki Haley,” Remensnyder said. “I was hoping she would run [as the Republican nominee].”
The retired audiologist voted for Trump in 2016 and then Biden in 2020. Remensnyder said she owned three doctors’ practices. As a business owner, she said, “I thought I could trust Trump. He was a businessman, but he was an absolute disaster” from the start, Remensnyder said.
And “as a medical professional,” she said she thought “what he did with COVID was embarrassing.”
But this time around, Remensnyder said she was “despondent” at the choice between Biden and Trump. She felt Biden’s mental fitness had declined too much to do the job any longer.
“I couldn’t trust him to run the government. … It really scared me,” she said.
When Harris entered, Remensnyder gave her a shot.
“I watched her,” she said. “I listened to her. I am a woman, and women’s needs are first, even before party.”
Remensnyder is pro-abortion rights and said she liked how Harris has advocated for women’s reproductive freedom, and she liked Harris’ experience as a litigator.
Remensnyder said she thought Harris did fairly well in the debate, but “did not answer most of the questions. She did skirt the issues. I don’t think she’s the best. I really, really wanted Nikki Haley.”
But she added that she is “confident” in Harris’ ability to do the job, though not confident she will win because of the clear gender divide she sees. Remensnyder said her husband and son are conservative and tell her they are leaving the presidential line on the ballot blank.
“They can’t force themselves to vote Democratic,” she said.
Thiago, 21, New Jersey, undecided if he will vote
A college student born in Brazil, he described himself as a progressive whose top issue is the war in Gaza.
“Donald Trump won’t get my vote,” Thiago said, pointing out that Trump’s position on the war is a nonstarter.
After Biden dropped out, he was waiting to see what Harris would do, but Thiago said her posture on Gaza “hasn’t been a great one.”
“I’m still undecided whether it’s worth it to vote for Kamala, given her not-great stance on Palestine,” Thiago said, “and given she’s reaching out more to conservatives than more-progressive members of her party.”
He watched the debate and said Trump was “off the ball in the same way Biden seemed entirely way too old and needing to step aside. Trump seemed to inherit that and seemed rattled by Kamala.”
Even if you’re on Trump’s side, Thiago said, it was “obvious” that “Trump didn’t do great in that debate.”
Thiago said he’s still going to vote down-ballot, but short of Harris saying she will cut off weapons shipments to Israel, he likely will leave the presidential line blank.
Ron Gideon, 61, Oklahoma, might not vote
A registered Republican, Gideon voted for Trump in 2016, but didn’t vote for him in 2020 “because of some of the choices he made.” He didn’t specify which ones.
Of Trump and Harris: “They both have their challenges.”
But he won’t be voting for Harris. “I understand her economic plan,” he said, “but her liberalism is a little bit too liberal.”
Gideon added: “This might be a situation where neither one of them gets my vote.”
John, 58, Florida, undecided
John is a registered independent originally from Nassau County, N.Y., and has a blue-collar background as the son of a firefighter. He considers himself a “liberal union Democrat.” He voted for Obama twice, even volunteered to “work the phones,” he said, and thought former President Bill Clinton “did a great job as president.”
He did not vote for Hillary Clinton in 2016 because of a personal experience; she didn’t show to an event he was involved with planning. In 2020, he said his son, who was 5 then, essentially cast his ballot for Biden, because he wanted to vote for him.
John said he’s not following the current presidential race that much, but did watch “a little bit” of the debate. His biggest concerns are housing affordability, groceries and gas prices.
“Trump was cuckoo for saying that the dogs and cats were being eaten,” John said, “but Kamala Harris wasn’t really answering any of the questions,” especially about the economy.
John said he wants to see something put forward to “stop the inflation.” John also doesn’t trust Harris (mispronouncing her name as “Camilla” at one point) because of her changed positions on things like fracking.
“I think Joe Biden did the best he could,” John said. “If he could have just grabbed the horns on inflation — things are through the roof. … It’s gone freakin’ nuts.”
